Service vs Sacrifice: A Conversation with Ornella
Find her here: Substack: https://substack.com/@ornellacoachhumandesign
Instagram: @ornella.coach.humandesign
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11 Nov 2026 · @Anna Dannfelt
Where does it come from?
Anna: Hi everybody. Today I’m here with my new friend Ornella. We’ve been chatting back and forth and I have so much to talk about, so today we want to share a little of our thoughts with you. Ornella, over to you.
Ornella: Thank you, Anna. Welcome, everyone, to this conversation. It’s going to be very interesting. We’re going to focus on how an act of service can be empowering when you’re paid for it. We’ll talk about where this comes from, and why it’s so hard for women to be paid when what they’re doing is an act of service.
I’m a coach in Human Design and NLP, and I’m very happy to have this conversation with Anna. We were just talking about the fact that women of all different ages, we’re sisters, and we all experience the same challenges in life.
One of them is very personal to me. Starting this business, it’s been very hard to feel okay about being paid for what I do. It’s not like the corporate world. It’s not something concrete, like a spreadsheet you hand over. So I think the main question is: where does that come from in women? This thing about service.
Anna: Can I start from the beginning? What’s coming to me very strongly from our conversations is that the patriarchal system built on a service instinct that was already in women. It’s natural for us to help and be supportive, because it’s part of who we are as women. But the system added: you’re a bad girl, you’re not good enough, if you’re not of service. That’s where it all started. And of course, then it’s easy to get women to do your bidding.
Moving forward through history, we women have become the ones who carry this forward to our daughters, because we teach them to be of service.
Just to put it in context: I was an aromatherapy teacher, and one person in my group asked me what I charged for treatments. I told him, and he said, “Oh, that’s terrible that you take money. With all the knowledge you have, it’s your duty to help people who are in a bad place.”
And I’m like, no, it’s not. It’s my duty to feed my four children at home.
That was the first time it really hit me. Hang on a minute, what is going on in this world of women? When we don’t have an actual contract that says you do this and you get this money, when we have to set it ourselves, it can be really, really difficult. And we can be attacked in so many ways for it. So again, over to you, Ornella, because this is something you’ve experienced.
The voice in our head when we ask to be paid
Ornella: Completely. I’ve been thinking about it since our last conversation, because I did a lot of things before becoming a Human Design coach. I worked in the movie industry, and I worked on a set for a month or two. Because I was there “for the experience,” I didn’t get paid. I gave so much of myself, and I never got the recognition.
And what you’re saying is true. Where does it come from? What’s the voice in our head when we ask to be paid? I keep seeing my grandma at the table, serving food, and my mom taking care of us kids for many years.
Anna: And you’re a mama too.
Ornella: I am, a mom of two. And I work part time in the corporate world, and I see it there too, with my colleagues, especially the women who are mothers. You always give a little more. You go the extra mile, you stay a bit longer, and you sacrifice something.
First you sacrifice your time, and time is one of the most valuable things we have. If you’re a mom, that’s time with your kids, or even your health, because you give way too much to something that isn’t yours. And you don’t value your own knowledge.
I think that’s the main thing. Why do we feel so guilty asking for money, when we’ve spent money and time learning and practicing? When we get paid, it’s a reward for what we know. It’s recognition, and it empowers us, because it’s a skill we’ve built.
When I catch myself doing something for free, I ask: would a man do this? Would a man accept not being paid for this? When I talk with male friends, they don’t see the world the way we do. They say, “But you’re being paid, right?” No, I’m not. Or you lower your prices because, well, you’re helping that person. Or: who am I to ask?
Anna: It’s about self-worth, how we devalue ourselves, not just our services. Our services are a symbol of how we value ourselves, our time, our effort, our training. When we get an education, it’s as expensive as a guy’s, right?
Ornella: Of course.
Anna: But we can’t claim the same level of knowledge as a guy has.
Ornella: No.
Anna: It’s like that riddle. A boy is in an accident and goes to the hospital, and the doctor says they can’t operate on him. The answer is that the doctor is his mother. The first time I heard it, I was like, hang on a minute, how does that work? Because in my head, the doctor was a man.
Ornella: Because it was the mom, and we didn’t think of the mom, because we’re so conditioned. It’s the little things. And it’s our responsibility to see it, because you won’t make progress in your life until you see it yourself. Otherwise you’re just following a pattern.
So it’s reading, and talking with other women, especially women with different experiences, because we end up living the same things.
I talk a lot with my husband about building this business, and I have so many doubts when it comes to charging. I check my programs and the prices again and again. To him it’s so clear what I’m giving. To me it feels like I should be giving it for free.
And you always give a little more because you love what you do. There’s always a freebie somewhere, and we enjoy it. But my husband says: at some point, if you ask me for this, then this service costs that amount. You add it up on the bill. For him, and for my male friends, it’s logical that everything you give has a price.
Service or sacrifice? Ask your body
Anna: I’d also add that people more easily accept a high price from a man. It’s “reasonable” that men are paid better than women, right?
And I want to come back to something we talked about earlier. You have small children, and I have grandchildren now, so I’m sort of back in the loop. Society is full of this, and it’s so invisible. School, play dates, daycare. Who’s going to bake the muffins? What is every woman doing for this event or that day at school?
The expectation is that the mothers do it. And if you don’t, you’re the bad mom. There will be gossip and angry looks, because you’re the bitch who isn’t pulling her weight while everybody else is working.
This programming shows up in so many discreet, hidden ways. And I think that’s part of what makes it so hard for women when they grow up and want to run their own businesses.
Then you come to my age, 60 and above. We’re not dealing with children or school anymore. We’re dealing with a world that says: oh no, you have one foot in the grave. Not interesting. You’re done. Bye-bye, go away, old lady. Suddenly, because you’re old, you’re not worthy. As a woman, that is. A guy can be as old as he likes. Look at the movies: the guy is old, the girl is young, and there’s the love story.
Ornella: And look at the presidents. They’re in their 80s and still making decisions for the world, and age only gives them more credibility. It’s so unfair.
But I think women are starting to wake up, at least my generation. I’m a millennial. Women my age are starting to know what they don’t want. And they’re starting to understand that their cycle is empowering. I see it in myself. You start to recognize, okay, I’m in my luteal phase, I’m going to have my period. You learn the signs in your own body.
Being grounded in your own body helps you decide what’s best for you. When you say yes to an act of service, is it a service, or is it a sacrifice? Your body will feel the difference.
If someone asks you for something, even for free, you can ask: is this a service? Do I feel good about giving a little more? You need to be able to come back into your body. And in Human Design, that’s what it’s all about: how does your body react to an opportunity? If your body says yes, go, you say: okay, that’s a great place, I’ll start there.
But a sacrifice leaves you depleted. You feel bad, used, not recognized.
Anna: Used, unseen, unloved, uncared for, undervalued. You feel like a piece of shit, somehow.
Ornella: Yes. You feel unrecognized. Honestly, I still feel it in the corporate world, and that emotion drags me down. It lowers your energy, and then it’s very hard to pull yourself back up, chin up, and say: no, I’m worth something.
“Real help is always free”
Ornella: And what you said about getting older, that the world looks at you like you’re worthless. I think after perimenopause and menopause, you step into a different kind of power. We’re cyclical. Women are the portal to life. It’s as simple as that. I saw a reel that said a creator would never bow to its creation. And we have created the whole world.
Anna: Yes, everything came through us. Each and every one of us is the ultimate goddess, right?
Ornella: You know it too. How unbelievable is it to create a person and bring them into the world? I think there are two parts to this. The first is that women need to recognize it in themselves. Because if you step back and look at how society treats us, you think: I don’t understand. We’re goddesses. We’re amazing human beings. We have our circles, our moon rituals, and those things are amazing. And when we gather together, like when you used to go to a club and everyone ended up in the ladies’ room...
Anna: All the girls are there, everybody’s talking, sharing makeup...
Ornella: ...chatting and hanging out.
Anna: I think this is the ultimate power women carry: the power to create life. Seriously, it is the ultimate power. And that’s why all this control has come down over thousands of years. If you control life, you control everything. So men had to control life, and put us in our place, and everything was built from there. Back in the day, we got burned or badly hurt for having our circles.
But there’s one more thing you mentioned earlier: “real help is always free.” Remember we talked about that? That’s another form of emotional blackmail laid on women. It uses our caring side. If somebody is suffering, it’s your duty to help, because you can, like that guy said to me.
In reality, there’s no way you can support or serve anybody if you don’t make sure you’re supported and in order yourself. Like I said, my duty was to feed my four children, not to take care of somebody who was stressed.
I think this is a big one that women carry, because we get asked: “But what do you do to help the world? What do you do to help people?” Well, I give money to the guy on the street. You know what I’m saying? It’s emotional blackmail, because it tells us that if we don’t give, we’re not worthy. And we’re back there again, right? It always comes back to that.
Ornella: It’s always questioning us. There’s always something wrong. It feels like you can never really win. That’s why you need to keep fighting and stay very conscious of who you are and of your power, and really focus on your goal.
So, is real help free? Yes and no. To your kids, it’s free. To your family, if you want, for sure.
“Don’t you ever shush me”
Anna: Okay, I’m going to jump in there. Our kids. You have a daughter, right?
Ornella: I have one son and one daughter, yes.
Anna: I have three daughters and a son. As mothers, because we grew up with this programming, how do we stop it? When you have children, life is all over the place all the time. You fall into habits, not because you’re not thinking, but because you don’t have time to reflect until afterwards. That’s a trap too: in a stressful moment, “be quiet, don’t disturb” comes out.
My daughter once said something to me as a grown-up, and I was so ashamed. We were sitting in my winter garden. I lived in Luxembourg then. She’s very loud. I’m loud, but she’s really loud. And I had neighbors who harassed me over every tiny thing, so I was always going “shh.” And I shushed her.
She just froze. Then she looked at me and said: “Don’t you ever shush me.”
Ornella: I like your daughter.
Anna: She could have slapped me. And I thought: oh my God. I suffered so much from being shushed growing up, and I did exactly that to her. It was such a big lesson for me, and I was in my 50s.
In a moment of stress, it comes up. And she was absolutely right. She can be as loud as she likes. I own this house. Shame on me. I still think about it and bring it up often as an example. I always reflected and really changed my ways with my children. I thought everything through before going into a discussion, because this is my work. And still, at 50-plus, I shushed my daughter who was about 30. That’s the programming.
Ornella: It’s very tough. But the fact that you realized it and could take a step back is amazing. I don’t think we realize how hard it is to actually see how we were programmed and become conscious of it. I see a lot of women my age who don’t notice they’re doing exactly what their own families did.
Anna: It’s invisible. It’s invisible because it’s so much part of who we are. It’s not something we learned. It’s something we were made to become. And that’s very, very different.
Ornella: Very different. My vision is that kids are here to teach us. My son is six, and a woman who channels guidance once told me: “Your son is here to teach you something.” And he definitely does. He’s very wise. Sometimes, when I put my stress on him, he looks at me and says, “But Mommy, that’s not a problem. We’ll do it later.” And I’m like, okay, you’re six.
And my daughter is two. I look at her and smile, because I try not to block her. She’s a free spirit. When I’m trying to do something, she screams “No!” and she’s tiny. And I go: you’re right. I’ll stop. I won’t take that from you. I try not to block her real energy, because she’s two and not conditioned yet. But it’s work on me.
Where the change starts
Anna: I think that’s a really good place to end: “I stop.” Because where do we start the change? We can start with ourselves anytime. But if we want to see bigger change, we need to help our children. Whether we teach kids at school or work as business women, we need to understand that this is a very real problem today. And once we understand it, we need to share it. That’s why we’re making this video today.
I love that there are, what, 25 years between us, and we still speak the same language. That’s what we want to show women: age doesn’t matter. We all share the same basics, because we are women.
I’ll put all the links with this video so you can find Ornella and me. But tell us a little about where you can be found.
Ornella: You can find me on Substack. I write in French and English, as you can probably tell from my accent, and I make guides in both languages. I’ll share my Instagram too. I’m trying to create a different world on Substack than on Instagram. The same idea, but bigger, like we talked about last time: inviting people in.
Anna: Substack is like having a home.
Ornella: You can invite people into your house.
Anna: You’re not just out there shouting into the street.
Ornella: Exactly. And there are lots of free things there, about the world, how you see yourself, and how to look at your life and your patterns. I’ll share all the links. It’s mostly Substack and Instagram.
Anna: So, lots of freebies.
Ornella: Women always do freebies, because we love sharing. The trap is knowing when to start taking money. But sharing is so easy, because it’s so much fun.
Thank you so much. This is such an essential conversation and I really love it. We could easily talk for another hour. We’d planned a quick coffee chat to see what we could talk about, and an hour later we were still going. If this opens minds and inspires women, I’m all for it. We need to get back into our power. Women are very powerful.
Anna: Did you hear that, every woman out there? Brilliant place to end. Thank you so much for joining us. I hope you enjoyed our little impromptu conversation, because we’ve had a lot of fun.
Find Ornella here:
Substack: https://substack.com/@ornellacoachhumandesign
Instagram: @ornella.coach.humandesign
https://calendly.com/ornella-humandesign/20min?month=2026-11
